I' J' Oral history interview wltn H.R. conducted bV Raymond H. and Fred j. GraoosKe at the PICKett Street Annex of tne Natlonai Arcnlves FJG: Mr. Haldeman, you said one item you dla want to talK about was the fire bombing of [the] Brookings [Institution). How did you learn of this plan? HRH: I'm glad to have a--I wasn't all that anxIous to talK acout it, It'S Just that that's something tnat closed duote, someday. like so many tnings in tne and somewhere the record's got to be set straight MaYbe this will be one opportunity to do that. Let me out a disclaimer In on a general baSIS so I do it once before--oecause It apolles to this as well as a lot of 0lher and then I'm not going to refer to it anymore. applies to the whole conversation this morning. ArId But, it tha't IS that in thinking aoout answering tnese questlons--and haVing soent a couple days worKing througn some archival material the last two days in another airection--it occurs to me, tnat in talKing tnis morning you [nave] got to, and the user of tnls material future has got to, recognize tnat tnis IS now 1987, the White House fourteen years ago, 1 left whlcn I presume What we're going to be talKIng aoout orlmarlly, have the aavantage of havlng--at I and that events In 'tne WnlTe House that tOOK olace prior to my departure, uo to eignteen years tnat In tne IS tOOK olace [ana] that you tne arcnivists least some of you--of naving mine--emphasis you might say on bad points. would suspect it's true of Henry and are there, In my case, and I also, the reason those in my case--because that's not my Y'lature to talk aoout the bad things, and I never did when I was in the White House, and I didn't intend to when I got out--was the demand literally by the publisher and my co-author that you have to cover those too in order to have aY'IY credibility, that you corltiY'lue to maintain the myth that this guy is absolutely perfect. got to face the fact, You've because the world knows that he is not. In case because the shade already has been lifted--they've heard him. I went through a long session with Billy Graham after the tapes were released. Billy was out in Los Angeles and called and wanted to get together, and I went over to the hotel and spent a whole afternoon. He was absolutely crushed. I can't believe what I've read in the tapes, And he said, "Bob, because," he said, "in all the hours I spent with Richard Nixon, and there many, many hours, he never said 'damn,' let alone all those things--the kinds of things I hear him saying on the tapes." -==i he And can't believe it, and I'm hoping that you will tell me that there's something wrong with the tapes, which I can't believe is the case. I tc.ld him--Richard Nixon had enormous respect for Billy Graham, enormous affection for him. B i 11 Y And he recognized him as a man of On the other hand, 92 when he was letting off steam, dealing with us, talking about things, he used locker room language. And I said to Billy GranaM, that that was not untypical, "I have to confirm to you it wasn't Just Watergate. If you hear the tapes of the early years, you'll hear the same stuff in the early years. It might have been worse under the pressure of Watergate at times, but it was always there. And it was tnere before he became PreSident, and I'm sure it's there now. I'm sure it is, because that's the way he talks. hate to tell you this, Billy, II And And I said, "I but I think that you would find, if any of your other friends, other than men of the cloth--and probably a lot of the men of the cloth too--if they had been taped in all of their conversations, at all times in all places, that they'd be using some of that language too. And maybe a lot more than you'd be able to believe of them, either. he said, II That helped him. I mean, you know, "I suppose that's true. said, "Everybody--we all--I use bad language wnen I talk to II I people who're using bad language, but "I don't use it when I'm talking to people who don't. I never have said that in front of my kids or my wife. But, you know, business associates and personal friends, do. brag. word like (withJ my and things like tnat, I'm not proud of that fact, and I'm not saying it to you to I!m saying it to you because it mlgnt help you to uncerstand that you, given the eminence that you nave as a man of the cloth, are going to be treated differently by people tnan other people." And he sort of understood that. That got me way off the track. FJG: I Wnere was 11 I think you were going to talk about some of Nixon's positive 93